Re: Game 5 Dead Thread

[RogueDream09]

ok. So I was right about the protection.

[megalan7]

I do agree that the mafia to townie ratio needs to be fixed and that was my major regret in the game. I probably should not have used the serial killer role at all. Or had the psychopath/psychiatrist roles like I said in the last post.

The town to mafia ratio has been an issue twice now. like I said in a post a moment ago. The fact that it can be said that me having figured out 75% of the mafia on night two being too late is dumb. That's barely anytime and I had most of mafia figured out. Props to LadyLuck for evading my watchful eye.

[KanedaC]

Yeah I know. I was agreeing with you.

[megalan7]

Yeah I know. I was agreeing with you.

Just confirming. Rant two in progress

[Wassamattawityucca]

I'd also like to say I dont quite understand why Wassa sacrificed herself for Jiro. It was Jiro that you saved from Tilted, right?? Jiro did nothing useful with his second chance at life. In my opinion, Wassa would've done the town more good.

I sacrificed myself, because it would have been stupid for me to allow two town deaths during the night which, according to Marvi would have happened if I hadn't done so.

Nothing useful? Really? Jiro and Megalan already had you, Rory, and Gwen down as Mafia. He was going to revive me tonight, and thus allow the town a confirmed Townie for them to rally around. I'll admit I'm a little disappointed that he apparently didn't use his power tonight, but that wouldn't have been a problem had it not been so easy to get the Town numbers equal to Mafia.

He may have figured us out but it was too late. His power as you said would allow the town a confirmed townie to rally around. A power which he didnt use. I would've used it the moment Ron died. And I thought you would've lived. you survived the mafia attack because hermione protected you, right?

But if you're saying he should have brought Ron back, how would he have brought Ron back is I didn't use my power and allowed him to die? Both my power AND his power forced us to give up out lives in exchange for another.

[KanedaC]

Actually, if Jiro had used his powers on Night 1, you wouldn't have had to die at all. Jiro's power was supposed to be activated before a kill could reach him. And since he was already dead, you didn't need to protect him.

[RogueDream09]

I'd also like to say I dont quite understand why Wassa sacrificed herself for Jiro. It was Jiro that you saved from Tilted, right?? Jiro did nothing useful with his second chance at life. In my opinion, Wassa would've done the town more good.

I sacrificed myself, because it would have been stupid for me to allow two town deaths during the night which, according to Marvi would have happened if I hadn't done so.

Nothing useful? Really? Jiro and Megalan already had you, Rory, and Gwen down as Mafia. He was going to revive me tonight, and thus allow the town a confirmed Townie for them to rally around. I'll admit I'm a little disappointed that he apparently didn't use his power tonight, but that wouldn't have been a problem had it not been so easy to get the Town numbers equal to Mafia.

He may have figured us out but it was too late. His power as you said would allow the town a confirmed townie to rally around. A power which he didnt use. I would've used it the moment Ron died. And I thought you would've lived. you survived the mafia attack because hermione protected you, right?

But if you're saying he should have brought Ron back, how would he have brought Ron back is I didn't use my power and allowed him to die? Both my power AND his power forced us to give up out lives in exchange for another.

I think your power is to sacrifice yourself to save your students from attacks on them. you cant save them from suicide.
If he chose to bring Ron back, it would have been a great resource for the town.
All I'm saying is that your sacrifice was against the towns best interest If Jiro wasnt gonna step up and do what his power was meant to do.

[megalan7]

Actually, if Jiro had used his powers on Night 1, you wouldn't have had to die at all. Jiro's power was supposed to be activated before a kill could reach him. And since he was already dead, you didn't need to protect him.

O____O

Run Moogle.......start running.

[megalan7]

RANT PART TWO

You guys REALLY need to work on poker faces. I don’t want to call people out but it’s the best way I can do this.
Jiroshi- In the Avatar game you stayed WAY in the background in comparison to how you normally play. The big clue was when I told you my role you did not try to use me. You took the info and ran.
Raaaawry- You need to work on lying. I pressed you hard for your role and presented you with evidence that proves without a doubt that I was town. You still tried to act like I couldn’t be trusted. Your best bet at that point was really to just throw out a role and hope I haven’t heard it before. You trying to dodge the subject was condemning you. Why'd I strike this out? Don't worry about it.
RogueDream- While you said you were gonna stick to yourself more, being too reclusive is bad. I came to you for an alliance and you were like no I’m good. A separated town can’t win. You showed up late in discussions and hid most the game. VERY unlike you. While I understood being reclusive, you went too far.
Gwenlover- Calling a role name as mafia is a viable plan, but it’s not a good idea to do it minutes before a vote. You want to be able to use your time with the disguise.

All in all I have seen you guys completely flip on how you play between town and mafia. I am not going to deny that I will probably play different when I’m mafia and will probably hit this same problem but we REALLY need to work on this.
BTW: Good Job LadyLuck. I legit thought you were trustworthy.

[KanedaC]

While Rogue's words are harsh, in the long run they are true. Of course, no one could have known this at the time.

[megalan7]

All I'm saying is that your sacrifice was against the towns best interest If Jiro wasnt gonna step up and do what his power was meant to do.

Question: Did we know Jiro's power at the time? (( Wassa please answer ))

[KanedaC]

She actually did. Though I'm not sure if she knew he was a suicidal role

And you also need to calm down, dude. It's an online mafia game. Between friends.

[RogueDream09]

While Rogue's words are harsh, in the long run they are true. Of course, no one could have known this at the time.

Thank you Kaneda

[megalan7]

I actually think I need to backout before people get pissed at me. I already had to delete one post.

[RogueDream09]

Hell, I knew what Jiro's powers were before Wassa's death!

[KanedaC]

Wait, how? Did he tell you?

And it's no big deal megalan. I just think you're too invested in the outcome of this is all.

[megalan7]

......SO MANY THINGS I WANT TO SAY BUT I DONT WANNA BE A DOUCHEBAG

[KanedaC]

Go for it. I do want feedback.

[megalan7]

One last rant because I personally feel this is a big problem.

Vague roles are not OK.

For a game like this to work people need to understand what is going on. There is already a lot of guesswork and investigation required. Having to put on top of that figuring out what roles do makes the game way harder than it needs to be. Example: I literally had NO idea what Neville's power was. For Hagrid I had it figured out down to what was limited before I heard from Jiro what it was. Also, I don't want to give all the details cus I will sound like an ass, but there was one major question I asked Kaneda that he wouldn't answer and town took a major hit because of it.

[RogueDream09]

yup. I remember because he was trying really hard to get me to reveal my role to him. And I was trying really hard to get him to doubt Wassa's way of playing by saying that she holds all this information and anything she shares is econd hand from her(the wassa-web is what I called it) and he told me who he was and how what he could do.
I was in the kitchen, pacing around as I often do while on the phone.

[megalan7]

Also, I'm not trying to be mean and I am trying to hold back my "I'm upset cus I lost and boohoo." but these are legitimate concerns of mine and I think working on them can help improve the game

[Wassamattawityucca]

Oh wow. Where to start. I guess I'll go with each paragraph.

1. I realized this after the game had started, but this was only because of the inactivity. I honestly think that if everyone had been equally active, it would have been balanced and I feel the town could have definitely won.

2. I didn't find it too difficult, but I did feel the pressure of people possibly complaining that it wasn't fair. I did my best to have roles that balanced each other out.
-Oh wow. I didn't know that. Why would they contact you? Isn't it illegal play to contact the dead? Guess I should have made that clear at the start of the game, but I thought everyone knew that it was against the rules.
-Thank you! I was actually inspired by the MLP game. I don't think it went bad at all. My only regret in that game was being sick so that I wasn't thinking/playing clearly for the majority of it. But I mainly did this so that people couldn't hide behind the "I'm a vanilla townie!" excuse this time around. I wanted to see what people would do when EVERYONE had an important role to play. It ended up with the town not being able to trust anyone, which is what you said was a flaw in the last dead thread. I think you were the only townie who was pretty much open to everyone else. The mafia played well on this fact.

3. I don't remember saying that. If I did I mispoke. Here's the of night actions of said night in order of me getting them:

Megalan7: protect Wassa
Tilted: Kill Jiroshi
Wassa: Protect Jiro
Lady: Kill Wassa

megalan would have protected you from the mafia had you not protected Jiro. If you had protected, say, Raaaawry that night, then you would not have died. Since you DID go for Jiro, even if megalan hadn't protected you, you would have still protected him. So basically megalan unintentionally wasted his power that night.

Thanks! And it was tough evading your PMs. I really had no idea what was kosher or not to tell you. But what I told you I told others that asked the same. Though I don't remember exactly what those were right now...

It was all myself. I only used a mafia wiki on roles for help. I just used what I thought fit each character best and what seemed balanced between teams. I was considering having Lupin be the werewolf and have him be a psychpath and having Hermione be a psychiatrist role, but decided against it. Looking back, it might have been a better idea.

1) More activity would have helped, but I still think making Day 2 the "break" point is still a little to close for comfort. That's why I agree with Megalan that the Avatar game failed in that aspect.

2) I guess what I meant to say is that I personally think it's impossible to balance a role-heavy game. Too many variables that you can't control.
-None of them contacted me at all. I was speaking in person with each of them when it happened and they did all most Mafioso have done is previous games, admitted they were Mafia to dead players. Since they weren't aware of a "bring back from the dead" role, they weren't aware that could affect the game. I don't forbid players from revealing to the dead (since it doesn't affect the game) but I DO forbid the dead from revealing things to Mafia. I didn't say anything because that would force me to reveal Luna's powers to a live player which IS against the rules.
-Ayup, no one wanted to trust, but that always happens so no biggie.

3) AH, I SEE! You were preforming Night Actions based on the order in which you receive them. Well, I guess that works, but I find it causes too much variations between different games especially as that can cause advantages for some powers if they use their power too early, or for others if they use it too late.

BLESS for using Mafia Wiki. BLESS.
Ah, so the Serial Killer could have been converted to Town in that situation? Hmmm, that might have been interesting.

[RogueDream09]

the mafia had to make some guesses too, as well as relying on what you've told us about your powers.
I personally LOVED Malfoy's power
and it does suck that town thought that the basilisk could kill ANYTHING(protected or not)

[KanedaC]

I understand your point, but I disagree. The vague roles were put there so that townies HAD to communicate if they wanted to win. And the bad guys couldn't hide behind the "vanilla townie" role anymore. I also did it because I felt like it would have been fun if I were a player. Sorry if it wasn't.

Well, the town didn't really take a hit because the game was over anyway, but now I'll explain why I didn't tell you.

The answer was already in Jiro's Role PM. If he didn't tell you it could have been because he didn't want you to know. If I told you I might have been interfering with the game. And if I told you to "go ask him" then that would give you the clue that he already knew about it. I was being impartial.

[KanedaC]

3) AH, I SEE! You were preforming Night Actions based on the order in which you receive them. Well, I guess that works, but I find it causes too much variations between different games especially as that can cause advantages for some powers if they use their power too early, or for others if they use it too late.

BLESS for using Mafia Wiki. BLESS.
Ah, so the Serial Killer could have been converted to Town in that situation? Hmmm, that might have been interesting.

3. No, sorry. Again, mispoke. I just posted the order in which I got them the actual order was:

Megalan7: protect Wassa
Wassa: Protect Jiro
Tilted: Kill Jiroshi
Lady: Kill Wassa

And if Jiro had used his power he would be at the top of the list.

And yeah, looking back I think it would have been interesting/the best if I had gone with that.

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